[Gvsig_english] gvSIG project structure

Sat Mar 27 13:29:40 CET 2010

Benjamin Ducke wrote:
> ----- "Luis W. Sevilla" <lsevilla at sigrid.es> schrieb:
>
>   
>> Hi Ben, Jorge (community),
>>     I have null interest in perform or participate in a flame war.
>>     
>
> I think we can all agree on that!
>
> [SNIP]
>  
>   
>> point, but an abstract could be: Big changes in project 
>> management/driving could be done before gvSIG could be considered an 
>> open project. It's free software, and collaborative. But not open 
>> because there's no openness in project decision taking, not
>> transparency.
>>
>>     
>
> So maybe for the immediate future, as regards gvSIG and gvSIG
> OADE, one approach would be to work very closely together regarding
> bug fixes, but keep an OADE branch for other changes such as GUI
> design decisions, that are not of critical importance but more a
> matter of "taste" or workflow habits.
>   
When I was at the commandment (or nearly) of architectural and technical 
project decisions, I had approached this issue by trying to have one 
extensible GUI architecture, that will allow all the behaviors needed in 
a single suite of code, remaining the specific behavior 'programming' to 
a sort of parametrization. I think development teams should (could) try 
to work together for allowing gvSIG to be a stronger, reacher and more 
flexible tool.
> I will have to think about some possible options for a while and
> will get back to you with some suggestions in the "gvSIG 1.9.1"
> message thread.
>
> I think in the long term, this closed decision making will have
> to be reconsidered if gvSIG is to attract a larger number of
> external contributors. Eventually, there should be a way for
> anyone with the right skills to become part of the decision
> making group. But that is an issue that can probably wait for 
> discussion until the right time comes.
>   
But this is an aspect only project driving forces can take into account. 
The have the drive weel, so it's up to them to share it with the 
community by habilitating main decision taking mechanisms for the 
community to participate.

Greetings
    Luis
> Best wishes,
>
> Ben
>
>   
>>     Greetings
>>        Luis
>> Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas wrote:
>>     
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>>> On 27/03/10 10:18, Benjamin Ducke wrote:
>>>   
>>>       
>>>>> a people at this project from the early times, that you words
>>>>>           
>> doen't 
>>     
>>>>> show appreciation not respect about all the effort that has
>>>>> successfully 
>>>>> carried the project from 0 to here.
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>           
>>>> :-O What did I say that makes you think so?
>>>>
>>>> I have been advertising gvSIG everywhere I go over the last
>>>> 3 years. And I have put a substantial amount of work into
>>>> it myself by now.
>>>>
>>>> If you want this to be a community project then you must allow
>>>> criticism.
>>>>
>>>> I know this is difficult, but the idea about a fully open source,
>>>> community-driven project is that you give up "ownership" of it.
>>>> This will inevitably lead to people having devided opinions about
>>>> this and that and some arguments going back and forth.
>>>> That's natural. I think we are all aware of each other's efforts
>>>> and appreciate them. Please do not expect people to just take what
>>>> you give them and be happy and grateful about it. That would be
>>>>         
>> nice 
>>     
>>>> (I develop software myself and know all about it) but it's an
>>>>         
>> unrealistic 
>>     
>>>> expectation. The psychology of a community-driven
>>>> project is different. Shared ownership of a project means that
>>>> everyone feels they are entitled to an opinion about it.
>>>>
>>>> I have always felt very grateful about gvSIG and the fact that
>>>> it's available as open source. But as I put more and more work
>>>> into it myself I also have a growing feeling that I have the
>>>> right to voice my opinion here.
>>>>
>>>> Criticism is not the same as disrespect. Criticism serves to
>>>> deal with issues early on, when they can still be fixed and thus
>>>> avoid further damage.
>>>>
>>>> Believe me, the argument we are having here is nothing compared
>>>> to what will happen once gvSIG gains a larger base of external
>>>> contributors. If you think this is bad, then read some posts
>>>> on the Linux kernel mailing list.
>>>> There are projects where there's fighting about
>>>> every new button in the user interface -- and it works!
>>>>
>>>> I have had several comments off list about a perceived lack of
>>>> openness in gvSIG's development model. I am just the first one
>>>> to mention that openly on this list and thus probably the one
>>>> to get burned for it. But I belief it needs to be done, for
>>>> the benefit of gvSIG and its community.
>>>>
>>>> I hope you will understand that this is really not a sign of 
>>>> disrespect for gvSIG, the work that's gone into it and the people 
>>>> who have done all that work.
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>         
>>> In my opinion you haven't been disrespectful, maybe too much
>>> enthusiastic on an small question mixed (if gvSIG is and old
>>>       
>> project
>>     
>>> or not) with a huge bunch of more important topics where we are
>>> probably quite sensitive.
>>>
>>> I mean, we try hard to be as much open as we can, dealing with
>>> everyday technical and organizational questions that sometimes are
>>>       
>> not
>>     
>>> really visible for most of you, so when someone do a joke or try to
>>>       
>> be
>>     
>>> funny with this kind of topics someone can feel bad.
>>>
>>> This is specially true for those that try to create the conditions
>>>       
>> to
>>     
>>> convert gvSIG in a sustainable project. So yes, we sometimes are
>>> sensitive with the value judgments made here.
>>>
>>> Oh my..., it's really hard to explain myself in plain English, can
>>>       
>> we
>>     
>>> speak about WMS or whatever????
>>>
>>> Anyway, I agree all your comments above regarding the necessity of
>>> criticism. I think we need criticism because it makes gvSIG better.
>>> I'm specially happy when someone says he feels he "owns" gvSIG
>>>       
>> because
>>     
>>> I feel the same. All the active users and develeopers here that
>>>       
>> spend
>>     
>>> their (weekend) time writing, promoting, blogging about gvSIG are
>>>       
>> part
>>     
>>> of the project. Without you gvSIG would be a dead project, and
>>>       
>> because
>>     
>>> of you I think gvSIG is a successful project and is here for a long
>>> time (at least the same as GRASS!!)
>>>
>>> Take care!!
>>> - -- 
>>> Jorge Gaspar Sanz Salinas
>>> gvSIG Team
>>> Tehcnical Steering Committe Manager
>>> http://www.gvsig.org
>>> http://www.gvsig.com
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>>>   
>>>       
>> -- 
>> Director Técnico / CTO
>> Sigrid - Grupo Acotelsa
>> Tel. +34 600 433 808
>> http://www.stereowebmap.com
>> http://www.sigrid.es 
>>
>> The secret to programming is not intelligence, though of course that
>> helps. It is not hard work or experience, though they help, too. The
>> secret to programming is having smart friends. (Ron Avitzur)
>>
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>
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-- 
Director Técnico / CTO
Sigrid - Grupo Acotelsa
Tel. +34 600 433 808
http://www.stereowebmap.com
http://www.sigrid.es 

The secret to programming is not intelligence, though of course that helps. It is not hard work or experience, though they help, too. The secret to programming is having smart friends. (Ron Avitzur)